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1711 Stone Street (in 1942)&#13;
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Appendix VI - 1865 Stone Street - John Adams Project&#13;
Bill Bates &amp; Bill Bates V Imaginary Diary Entries - John Adams Project</text>
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Erin Kellen, MPL Youth Services,&#13;
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              <text>The following are excerpts from the diaries of some hypothetical persons who grew up in the Toulminville area during the 1830s and the 1930s and 1940s. The first two excerpts come from the diary of Bill Bates, a slave owned by the Bates family who lived in Toulminville between 1838 and 1839. The last four excerpts come from the diary of Bill Bates V, a descendant of the earlier Bill Bates. These four excerpts explore the life of a young black person during the 1930s and 1940s. Some of the situations and ideas in these excerpts may not be completely factual but they are based on factual information. The purpose of this is to give people an idea of what life was like during certain periods of time, particularly during the Depression and World War II.&#13;
&#13;
January 5, 1838&#13;
Today my family and I left Mobile with my master's family and came to our new home in the country . Our home is near a large creek (Three Mile Creek) and there is a lot of wide open space surrounding my master's house. The Bates home (1) is a large two story house with the first story made of brick and the second story made of wood with very high stairs leading to a porch hanging out from the second floor. The brick bottom story was built by my father and some other slave masons about a year ago. The ceiling of the bottom floor is very tall which makes the house seem even larger to me and there are two chimneys. One last thing about the house is the big open "galerie" across the back which allows the Bates family to come out and admire the beauty of their land. My house is in back of the master's house near the kitchen (2). It is nice but much smaller than the big house.&#13;
&#13;
As we came into this new community today I didn't see any schools but it wouldn't matter to me anyway since it's against the law for slaves to be educated. The only reason I can write is because the master's son, my white friend, taught me. My friend is taught by the mistress in the big house since there is no school. Although I didn't see any school, I did find out that there are other rich families in this area other than the Bates family (3). There are the Toulmin lands to the east, the Goldthwaite lands to the northwest and the Files family home on St. Stephens Road which runs north and west (Appendix II). I'd better go now because I have to collect wood for the master's fireplace and the kitchen stove.&#13;
&#13;
July 5, 1838&#13;
At this time of year the outside doors of the big house are left open so that any wind can flow into the hall of the house and the kitchen by way of the breeze-way which connects them. The rear "galerie" and second floor porch allow air to also cool the top floor. Each day I have to go to the creek and bring water back to the house for drinking, washing, and cooking. Later today I hope I will have time away from my work to take a swim in the creek. It's a lot of fun and it makes it easier to live in this heat. &#13;
There is no church in this area (the first known church in Toulminville was built in 1846) (4) but that doesn't keep us from talking to God and tomorrow a group of us will get together to sing and pray.&#13;
&#13;
July 20, 1930&#13;
This morning my family moved into a small house in an area north of Mobile. My new address is 1760 Stone Street (Appendix III). From the outside the house looks long and narrow and has a small porch. It has four windows along each side of the house and there seems to be an extra room at the back of the house which has been added on since the house was built a few years ago. Although the house seems a little closed in because of its size, the porch with its beautiful column designs gives me a feeling of welcomeness (6). When I'm ar home I can play on the side of the house or in the backyard where there is a lot of room. This house we moves into today is smaller than the house we had been living in but we had to move into this house because my father lost his job and couldn't afford the other house. We do have electricity (7) in this house but we don't have running water because we couldn't afford it. Times are hard and it's too bad that many hard workers (laborers) like my father are the first to lose their jobs. &#13;
&#13;
December 3, 1936&#13;
This morning after waking up and getting dressed I walked to school with some friends. I had to walk down St. Stephens Road past Gorgas School (Appendix IV), a school for white children, past Finch Avenue all the way to Andrews Street where I go to class at Toulminville School (Appendix V), the school I've been going to since I came to Toulminville. &#13;
Our church had a special gathering planned for today so after school I walked down St. Stephens Road pass Craft Highway to Greer Autry and Sons, a small grocery store, and then further down the street to Butler Sea Food Store where I picked up some things for the church picnic. About an hour after I got home my family was ready to go to the picnic. Before going to the church we drove to the Big S Station (2) on St. Stephens Road north of Craft Highway. There my father bought a couple of dollars worth of gas which had to last him for the whole week. Then we drove all the way back down the road until we for to St. Charles Avenue where we went to meet the other members of Ebenezer AME Church. Then the whole congregation drove down to St. Charles Avenue to Stone Street and then to Davis Avenue where we stopped for our picnic at Davis Avenue Playground. After the picnic my family and I went back to our house on Stone Street and brought an end to a very nice day. &#13;
&#13;
January 7, 1942&#13;
Today was the day that our family moved into our new house (Appendix VI). The new house is just across the street from our old house on Stone Street but it seems a little bigger than the old house and now we have more yard space. Our new address is 1711 Stone Street (7). We were able to move into the new house because now that my father has a job building ships to be used in the war, we can afford a nicer home. Also, as a result of the growing business and industry in the Mobile area many people have begun settling in Toulminville. Our new house seems bigger because the rooms are spread out more than those in the house we had before with one room right after another. Another nice thing is that now we have electricity as well as running water which we didn't have before (8). The house has a small porch, three windows, and a door in front. There are two windows on each side, and additional room in the back, and a chimney on one side. On the same lot there is another building which can be used for storing things or for extra rooms and between the two buildings is a lot of space to play. &#13;
After we got most of our things moved in this morning it was time to do to church so the family piled into the car and we drove to Ebenezer AME Church on St. Charles Avenue (9). After church I decided to have a little fun by going to Davis Avenue Playground to play basketball. So I went home, changed, and walked all the way down Stone Street to Davis Avenue. There is another park that is easier to get to, but black people aren't allowed to go there. It's the Toulminville Recreation Center on St. Stephens Road and it's only a few blocks from my house. Anyway I had a good time at the park and now I think I'll call it a day. &#13;
&#13;
April 8, 1942&#13;
This morning I got up and walked down Stone Street to Davis Avenue where I go to Dunbar High School, a school only for blacks. After school was out for the day I walked up Stone Street, cut through St. Charles Avenue and went up St. Stephens Road until I reached Richardson's Grocery. This is where I work each day after school. Today I moved and unloaded boxes and packages and collection and scrap metal to be used for machinery in the war. After working late I went home and that about finishes up my day. &#13;
&#13;
Critique&#13;
John Adams's Project&#13;
&#13;
Using an imaginary diary to give an account of growing up in Mobile between the two World Wars was an excellent idea. It would be appropriate to use the word "imaginary" in the introduction, or whatever other word John might like, in order to clarify in the reader's mind  what is fact and what is used to portray the facts.&#13;
The narrative is interesting, moves smoothly and is well written. There are some mechanical factors that need correction. Since John has presented his sources for the facts interwoven with the narrative, they should be footnoted, even though a real diary would not have done so. The footnotes at the end should be numbered and related to the same number within the body of the text. In that way there can be no doubt in the reader's mind of the authenticity of the material presented. John seems to have gone through his text and marked in red where he wanted the footnotes to go but they did not all relate to the proper references. There was also no distinction in the red corrections to indicate the difference between footnotes and the illustrations. I have tried to indicate in a green pen where these problems occur. Again John may feel that such details would not be included in a real diary, in which case he could give the information in the introduction, leaving the text of the diary without references.&#13;
&#13;
It would be a good idea to put a "c" before the dates of the 20th century houses since the precise dates were not established by chain of title of tax records. Thus c1936 indicates to the reader that the time of construction was about that date but might be off by a few years. I would not be surprised if the 1936 cottage were not earlier, based solely on the style. &#13;
&#13;
The word "galerie" is a French term used in architectural descriptions to mean a porch and is used in connection with styles that have evolved out of an earlier colonial tradition. It is thus distinguished from the gallery of a theater or art museum. It should be written in italics but if not then indicated by "  ".&#13;
&#13;
If the map, indicated by the number VII, were intended to be a reference for the location of the Toulminville Recreational Center, mentioned on the next to last page of the Diary, it should have been marked on the map. There was a small 7 placed above this reference in the text but it was not differentiated as to whether it was a footnote or an illustration. These two reference sources should be indicated differently, the footnotes by a simply number above the reference and the illustrations by (ill.VII).&#13;
&#13;
In conclusion, the project was well developed. The research was ably explored for the time interval allowed. I hope that John will continue to study the area as no definitive information has ever been written about the neighborhood and it has a long and interesting history for which prime resources go back to the early 18th century French land grants.&#13;
&#13;
John Adams, a black male, aged fiftenn, chose to do an architectural study for his "Growing Up in Mobile - Depression &amp; Wartime" project. He chose several houses in a Toulminville neighborhood in which he lives as the subject of his study. Until recent years, Toulminville has been a white neighborhood. John focused his report on black residents, nevertheless, which contributes somewhat to the interest of his report.&#13;
&#13;
Notes&#13;
1  Bates (Schusse) house description from Mobile Landmarks Inventory, Mobile City Planning Commission.&#13;
&#13;
2  Description of kitchen with covered walkway to the Bates house and adjoining slave  quarters from letter to Dot Webster, Webster Realty, to Nancy Holmes, Mobile Historic Development Commission.&#13;
&#13;
3  Information concerning families or property near Bates home from letter from Mobile Historic Development Commission to Dot Webster, December 7, 1971; from Landmarks Survey, Mobile City Planning Commission, Chain of Title, November, 1974; and from "Toulminville One of Oldest Neighborhoods," News Herald, 21 September 1978, p.6.&#13;
&#13;
4  First known church in Toulminville built 1848 . Ibid.&#13;
&#13;
5  Address of house at 1760 Stone Street, Mobile City Directory, 1936. Description of house from photographs, appendix III.&#13;
&#13;
6  Information concerning water service and electrical power from Alabama Power Company.&#13;
&#13;
7  Locations of Gorgas School, Toulminville School, Autry Greer and Sons, Butler Seafoods, Big S Station, Ebenezer A.M.E. Church and Davis Avenue Playground from 1936 Mobile City Directory.&#13;
&#13;
8  Address of house at 1711 Stone Street, Mobile City Directory, 1942.&#13;
&#13;
9  Ibid., Alabama Power Company.&#13;
&#13;
10  Locations of Ebenezer A.M.E. Church, Davis Avenue Playground, Toulminville Recreation Center, Dunbar High School and Richardson's Grocery from 1942 Mobile City Directory. &#13;
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              <text>"Growing Up in Mobile, Depression and War Time" Architectural Study&#13;
Project: Compare and contrast wealthy upper-class housing of the 1930s with wealthy upper-class housing at the turn of the century.&#13;
&#13;
The Vickers House: built 1935-36, located at 29 Hillwood Road in Spring Hill, west of I-65. A modest two-story house, side-hall plan. Small one-bay porch front entrance, with brick stoop and steps and brick walkway leading up to pebbled half-circle driveway. A closed, private-looking house, with its screened-in porch in the southwest corner, (bottom floor) and, originally, a covered back porch off the kitchen (now walled-in and the kitchen expanded). Set in the middle of a huge lot, with a pebbled driveway offering two entrances to the front of the house, which is on a corner lot surrounded on the two street-sides by a white picket fence. Trees hide the house almost entirely from view from the road. &#13;
Children played in the yard, the ditch behind the lot, the neighbors' yards, or the woods (where houses now stand). This meant that the children stuck close to home, a safer environment than if they had lived downtown and played in the streets. &#13;
Ten-inch cypress boards side the exterior, red brick makes up the front stoop and steps, walkway, and stairwell leading outside from the southwest screened-in porch. The materials for the house came mostly from other houses being torn down at this time (1935). These "second-hand" materials were less expensive, but of high quality. The simple, rectangular design of the house, its modest size (the Vickers originally planned to add a wing on the north side eventually, but built a house over the Bay instead), and the second-hand materials used in its construction indicate the limitations set by the Depression, during which the general attitude, even among the wealthy, was one of caution and concern over the financial risk involved in the construction of a private home, especially since few people in the 1930s could afford to build, much less live in, a new house.&#13;
Hillwood was a new area of Spring Hill when the Vickers built their house in 1935 (theirs was the first home built in the area, not including the three "model homes" in Hillwood built in the 1920s before the Depression, which temporarily ended further development of homes in the area). Hillwood is and was an obviously wealthy suburban street, in the same neighborhood as the "restricted" Mobile County Club. White families, with black servants, have always been the rule in Hillwood. The houses on Hillwood are nearly all different, having been built at different times and through different architects in the years since 1935. &#13;
The interior of the house has hardwood floors and paneling (probably oak); a blue marble fireplace in the living room downstairs; indoor plumbing (two-and-a-half baths, 1 1/2 downstairs, one upstairs); a small kitchen with all modern convenience in the back of the house; electricity and a ceiling fan in the southwest screened-in porch; and a cellar-utility area for clothes-washer, servants' room. The house was probably heated through a combination of gas, electricity, and the fireplaces up- and downstairs. Fans and open windows cooled the house. Everything mentioned above in this paragraph was original to the house at the time it was built.&#13;
The roof of the house is a moderately steep gable-style, practical for Mobile's rainy climate. Window arrangements are not practical - the kitchen has the fewest (and the smallest) windows, yet it is the hottest room in the house. The Vickers made sure that the other rooms in the house had enough strategically-placed windows to insure a "nice view of the yard"; in other words, the practical purpose of windows, i.e. to provide light and air-circulation, were not considered as important by the Vickers as the "nice view" the windows could provide. Many trees shade the yard, but these are not very close to the house, which would be very uncomfortable without air conditioning. &#13;
The Vickers house has few details which would "date" it to the 1930s. Part of the reason for this is that the house was "made to order", its design reflecting the personal preferences of the Vickers when they built the house in 1935. Another reason it is difficult to "date" the house is that it was constructed of second-hand materials, from houses built years before 1935. For instance, the ten-inch wide cypress siding on the houses's exterior was more common in the 19th century than in the early twentieth century, during which time exterior siding was much narrower and consisted of non-organic shingles, asbestos, stucco, etc. (becomes typical of homes built in the inter-war period). &#13;
However, several details of the Vickers house indicate that it was built in the Depression year. These details include the fact that the house is much less" street-oriented" than houses built in earlier periods when people would sit on their front porches and visit with their neighbors while the children played in the street. The Vickers house, with its large back yard, its private, screened-in porch, and its location on the lot (set back from the street and hidden from view by trees, the lot surrounded by a white picket fence as a symbol of "private property") is an example of the growing trend in the inter-war years towards privacy, when people more or less cut themselves off from their neighbors by moving inside their houses and into their back yards. The small one-bay porch/ stoop front entrance of the Vickers house is not as open and welcoming as the large front porches of Victorian houses built at the turn of the century or bungalows built in the 1920s. &#13;
The Depression evidently caused a change in the general attitude towards money - people who had wealth in the 1930s were careful not to "show off" their wealth. The Vickers could have afforded to be much more extravagant in designing their house, but they kept it simple. The Vickers' rectangular-shaped "town house" has little or no decoration other than: dark green "false" shutters on windows at the front of the house; a wrought-iron handrail on the stairwell leading outside from the southwest screened-in porch; a sunburst window above the front door sill; a gas light/lamp at the end of the front brick walkway; a white picket fence around the street sides of the lot; and several flower beds and many different types of trees in the yard. Even inside the house everything is kept simple: wood paneling instead of wall paper; hardwood floors, with rugs in only a few rooms. The blue marble fireplace in the living room is perhaps the most decorative detail of the house. &#13;
&#13;
The Tissington House - built 1901, located at 1216 Government Street at Georgia Avenue, west of Broad Street but east of Ann Street, so it is extremely close to downtown and lies on the north side of Mobile's "main street" (Government). A very large house with an open, roomy front porch and second story balcony wrapping around the west side of the house from the front. Two-and-a-half stories, the Tissington house has numerous windows, balconies, dormers, and a large tower (turret). It was built on a central-hall plan. The house takes up most of the corner lot on which it was built. The front yard is somewhat larger than the backyard, and concrete steps lead from the front door/ porch to a wide concrete walkway, which empties onto a sidewalk surrounding the lot on its street sides (this sidewalk extends around the block and is typical of downtown Mobile, which has sidewalks in every area, residential and business). These sidewalks were important especially for the children of the Tissington house, since they lived on one of Mobile's busiest streets. The children probably played on the large porch or inside the house in bad weather, in the street or on the sidewalks otherwise. The Tissington house is so large it certainly offered the children enough room to play inside or to be alone if they wished. &#13;
The house has five- to seven-inch clapboard exterior siding and the roof is shingled, with decorated fascia boards. The jigsaw and the spindle were among the advancements in technology of the nineteenth century, and both were used to create this typical Victorian house, with its spindle-wood balustrade and jigsaw railing on the front porch and second-story balcony, and the Victorian-turned columns and wooden handcarved decorations on the tower, dormer, and front-porch roof. The house also features stained glass windows. The size and design of the house indicate a type of extravagance in which the wealthy homebuilder of the turn-of-the-century could indulge, whereas the wealthy homebuilder in the Depression era was more inhibited and careful with his money. &#13;
The Tissington house is one of several Victorian homes in the area of Georgia Avenue and Government Street. The families living in these houses were of the upper-middle/ wealthy class, and their racial background was white, their servants were probably black. One street over, north of the Georgia-Government area, is Caroline Avenue, which is lined with tiny low-income Victorian "shotgun" houses, also built near the turn-of-the-century, like the Tissington house. &#13;
The Tissington has three parlors downstairs; a kitchen in the back of the house (with a marble sink); indoor plumbing; electricity for fans; probably gas for heating as well as the fireplaces (the fire-place in one of the parlors is dark brown marble); hardwood floors covered with narrow-cut carpets; oak paneling and large-patterned wallpaper on the walls. A house this large certainly required several servants to help with its upkeep and the owner's image. &#13;
The Tissington is a pure Victorian house, like any other Victorian house built in California, Kansas, or Maine. It adapts to Mobile climate through its open spaces, high ceilings, steep-pitched roofs, and especially through its large porch and balconies. It has many windows, mostly placed wherever they would look best, some of them of stained/ leaded glass. This house might have been more comfortable without air-conditioning than would the Vickers house, which is smaller and not as well ventilated. &#13;
Many details "date" the Tissington house to the turn-of-the-century, including: stained/ leaded glass in windows; narrow-cut carpet on the floors; Victorian-turned columns on the porch; wooden handcarved designs on the tower (turret) and dormers; the decorated balustrade around the porch and balconies (jigsaw design on the railing, spindled balusters); detailed molding around the windows; many different sizes and shapes of windows. The tower itself, in addition to cupolas and turrets, were also common to the Victorian style of architecture represented in the Tissington house's design and construction.&#13;
&#13;
The houses of the 1930s were built in the Depression era, a time when people either did not have money or were very careful wit hit. Therefore, the houses built at the turn-of-the-century, a time when most people had fewer financial problems, would be fancier than houses built thirty years later. The people living in the Tissington house in the early 1900s could probably walk to shops and schools because they lived in town. But at the time the Vickers house was built (1935), Spring Hill was a suburb, "out in the country", and the children had to ride bikes to school and the Vickers had to drive into town to work or shop.&#13;
&#13;
&#13;
The Mobile Public Library Study Grant: Growing Up in Mobile, Depression and Wartime&#13;
Evaluation of Rebecca's architectural project&#13;
Project: To compare and contrast the wealthy upper class housing of 1930 with the wealthy upper class housing of the turn of the century.&#13;
&#13;
The two houses selected by Rebecca were well chosen to illustrate the contrast in architectural development of the two periods. They also demonstrated the changes  in the suburban growth of their respective years. The drawings added much to the project. Not only were they well done but they brought out essential differences in the architectural elements. The written descriptions were detailed enough to bring out the purpose of the project, that of the effect of housing on a child growing up in those surroundings. It would have been helpful if Rebecca could have interviewed Mrs. Tissington as she did Mrs. Vickers and it was unfortunate that she could not go through the interior of the Tissington house to get an accurate picture of the plan, not because she did not try.&#13;
From the social standpoint the conclusions drawn were well stated. From the architectural standpoint it might have been interesting to have added a comment on the difference in craftsmanship evidenced in the details of the building since that is the point brought out by the drawings. Both Rebecca and her advisor, Jennifer, did a good job with the subject selected and carried out within the allotted time. They took many trips to the buildings, the photography was excellent and the drawings show much talent on the part of Rebecca.&#13;
Elizabeth B. Gould, architectural historian</text>
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              <text>R.C. : Today is June 21st, 1983. This is Reeve Carlson. I'm interviewing Mary Francis Plummer at the Haunted Book Shop. This interview is part of the Growing Up in Mobile Oral History Project. Tommy Oberding is assisting with the interview today. We're going to be talking about Ms. Plummer's experiences growing up in Mobile during World War II. We'd like to thank you for talking to us today about your experiences during the time you were in Mobile. To begin, would you state for the records your full name and when you were born.&#13;
M.F.P. : My full name if Mary Francis Young Plummer and I was born in October, 1913.&#13;
R.C. : Who were your parents?&#13;
M.F.P. : My mother was Frances Fuller Thompson, my father was James Madison Young, and they were in Henderson, North Carolina.&#13;
R.C. : What were their occupations?&#13;
M.F.P. : My father was a druggist and my mother kept house.&#13;
R.C. : Did you have any brothers and sisters?&#13;
M.F.P. : I had three brothers and one sister. My sister was older than I and my three brothers were younger than I.&#13;
R.C. : When did you move to Mobile?&#13;
M.F.P. : In September of 1940.&#13;
R.C. : What was Mobile like when you moved here?&#13;
M.F.P. : When I came, I knew only one person, he was the Episcopal minister at Christ Church, and I was going to be the Director of Religious Education at Christ Church. I knew most of the people in Mobile at that time soon after I was here for a week. But every time I would go to town I would see nobody I knew, and it was a strange feeling.&#13;
R.C. : What are some of your memories of World War II?&#13;
M.F.P. : Well, first of all, as I said, I knew practically mobody and then all of a sudden I knew everybody in town. I was given a map of the city and a list of parishioners, and told to call on the people, and I knew everybody, and I would go to the post office and I would see my friends, and I'd go through the park and I'd see my friends, and all of a sudden World War II came along and we were flooded with strangers. &#13;
R.C. : Do you remember any changes during this time?&#13;
M.F.P. : Loads of changes. You couldn't find a house to live in; you couldn't find food to eat; you couldn't find tired to put on your car; you couldn't find gasoline to ride around on. Everything was short, and Mobile just began to grow and grow and grow.&#13;
R.C. : Did you know any of these newcomers who came during World War II?&#13;
M.F.P. : I met quite a lot of them. Brookley was established and a couple of people from Brookley Field would come in the Haunted Book Shop. I might back up a little bit and say that at Christ Church my husband was a Boy Scout master over there and I married him, and I left my job as Director of Religious Education to help him with the Haunted Book Shop. And there I met a lot of strangers.&#13;
R.C. : Did any of the newcomers move into your neighborhood at this time?&#13;
M.F.P. : Well, our Book Shop was in the little building over on Conception Street with a driveway through it. Upstairs we rented rooms to people who came to work at the shipyard, so we saw lots of people.&#13;
R.C. : Did people in your neighborhood rent rooms to newcomers?&#13;
M.F.P. : Yes, they did. One night we went out, we were going to dinner with a stranger who was in Mobile, showing him the city, and we just walked out and left the door open to the Book Shop. When we came back we found a sailor in there selling books. He had taken over, the money was all in the cash register and everything was fine. He said he had a grand time running the Haunted Book Shop for us while we were out. Never saw him before.&#13;
R.C. : How did people feel toward the newcomers?&#13;
M.F.P. : I think there were mixed emotions. My husband and I, we used to enjoy meeting them and sometimes we would take them home for the weekend. I remember one of my prettiest china dishes, a boy from Australia was fixing us a Sunday dinner, and he sat this platter on the stove and it cracked. But, we used to take people out to ride and all the girls would go down to the USO Hall and entertain the soldiers and dance with them and feed them. All in all, we tried to make them welcome.&#13;
R.C. : Were the fathers and mothers of any of your friends in the military or working at Brookley Field during this time?&#13;
M.F.P. : No, I had a brother in the military service, but he was stationed in Germany. He never did get to Brookley Field.&#13;
R.C. : Do you recall seeing a lot of servicement or military personnel during this period?&#13;
M.F.P. : Yes, they were all over the streets of Mobile and the stores would stay open late at night, and you'd see them on Sunday. The town was just floating with military people. &#13;
R.C. : Did you know anyone who worked in the shipyards or in other defense industries?&#13;
M.F.P. : I did indeed. One of the girls that I lived with just before I was married (I had an apartment), she was a welder at the Mobile shipyard. Some people would think that she was just as pretty as she could be and she was doing a patriotic job, and other people would say "I don't think that women ought to be in the shipyard welding."&#13;
R.C. : At this time were you working here at the Haunted Book Shop?&#13;
M.F.P. : Yes, I was.&#13;
R.C. : Do you remember people in Mobile volunteering for war work?&#13;
M.F.P. : Yes, as a matter of fact, before I was married, when I was working at Christ Church, I used to work all day and then I would go down to the Scottish Rite Building, for the "Command Center" (we called it), and we would plot airplanes and where they were, and we'd work there every night from nine until twelve o'clock.&#13;
F.M. : I have a question. Since you worked at Christ Church, do you feel that religious involvement is greater now or less now than it was when you first came to Mobile?&#13;
M.F.P. : In my particular church I think it's less than it was. Caper Thadley (Capers Satterlee?) was a very civic-minded person and he had a nursery school upstairs for the mothers who were working during the war. The church parish house was always open to organizations that wanted to meet there, entertain the soldiers, or have dinners. The people from the auxiliary were made aware of the men being in town and were really working for them.&#13;
R.C. : Do you remember any of the rationing during World War II?&#13;
M.F.P. : I surely do. You couldn't get tired and you couldn't get gasoline. My husband had tuberculosis, and right after we were married he went to get some insurance and they told him his other lung had gone bad on him. My minister advised us to go back to the doctor who had done the surgery on him to begin with, which was in Tennessee, and I can remember crying all night long because I didn't have enough gasoline to go and I couldn't get enough gasoline to go back to Tennessee. Finally, I guess my heart took over, and people loaned me stamps, which, of course, was strictly against the rules, you didn't borrow ration stamps, but I did and we went to Tennessee to see the doctor. &#13;
R.C. : What was Mardi Gras like?&#13;
M.F.P. : There was no Mardi Gras during the war. It was completely stopped.&#13;
R.C. : Do you recall any unusual or outstanding persons in Mobile?&#13;
M.F.P. : I don't know that you would call them unusual, it seemed rather queer to me though. I remember distinctly a man coming in one day to buy some Pocket books, and while I was selling him Pocket books he was telling me about wanting guns out of Mobile into the foreign countries. Another funny story was, a girl was working for us in the book shop and somebody came to my husband and said "Do you know this girl? She's a spy," and so my husband felt duty-bound to go over to the FBI and talk to them about the girl working there and tell them that she had been reported as a spy. It turned out the girl was working for the FBI.&#13;
R.C. : Do you remember any other ways in which the war affected everyday life in Mobile?&#13;
M.F.P. : Yes, everybody went to the seventh grade at Barton Academy, and of course every seventh grade child knew every other seventh grade child, and after the war the schools sprang up all over Mobile. Not only was there just one big Murphy High School or one bid seventh grade, there were many different schools. Now there were a lot of people that didn't even know each other any more. &#13;
R.C. : What were some of the changes in the appearance of Mobile?&#13;
M.F.P. : Well, every business place was busy, the LeClede Hotel was where I move d my shop from Conception Street to Government Street. It was a busy, buzzing street. The old courthouse was there, the Alabama Hardware and Sears Roebuck. Of course they tore down the Alabama Hardware, they tore down Sears Roebuck and moved it over on Royal Street. Then, in the sixties they built that Springdale Plaza and all the stores from downtown, Sears Roebuck and Hammels and Kaysers and Raphaels, and all of those stores moved out to Sprindale Plaza. And then of course they built Bel Air Mall right across the road from it, and downtown was almost a ghost town.&#13;
F.M.. : Mrs. Plummer, why did you move your shop the first time?&#13;
M.F.P. : Because the building we were in on Conception Street was leaking, and water and books don't mix very well. So we found out that Government Street, on account of where the Railway Express Company had been at Government and St. Emmanuel Street, was available, had enough space and it was a good location.&#13;
F.M. : And how long were you there?&#13;
M.F.P. : Twenty seven and a half years.&#13;
F.M. : How did your bookstore get its name?&#13;
M.F.P. : My husband and Adelaide Trigg, Adelaide Marsten Trigg, opened it in 1940, and about that time Christopher Morley was a very popular writer. He wrote his first book, Parnassus on Wheels, an old book-seller had a book shop in a covered wagon, and they traveled up and down the eastern seaboard selling books. They could produce the right book for the right person at this right time. When he married, he and his wife settled in Boston, and they ran the Haunted Book Shop and it was haunted by the ghosts of all great literature. They lived in the house and the books were right there; it's a good spy story because they had a wall in the Haunted Book Shop and a spay came in and left messages for other spies. Quite entertaining, you ought to read it sometime. We wrote him and asked him if we might name our shop after his story and he wrote back a real cute letter and said other shops had tried it and they'd all gone broke but it'd be brave to try.&#13;
R.C. : Did Mobile look different or seem different after the war?&#13;
M.F.P. : Very different. With the coming of the war there were so many people. When you;d drive through the Bankhead Tunnel they had built a school over there called Blakely School, and they had built houses all over there, people lived on Blakely Island. Of course, after the war they tore the houses down, and people all moved out on the western side of town, but there were houses all down Conception Street and people actually lived right downtown. Now of course people would come down in hats and gloves, and meet at the Battle House.&#13;
R.C. : What kind of hats did the ladies wear?&#13;
M.F.P. : Good, big, floppy hats with flowers on them, and gloves.&#13;
R.C. : Were feathers on the hats popular at that time?&#13;
M.F.P. : No, I think there were flowers more than feathers.&#13;
R.C. : Did Mobile change during the war?&#13;
M.F.P. : Changed very much.&#13;
R.C. : What things changed and stayed the same?&#13;
M.F.P. : To tell you the truth, I don't know that anything stayed the same. Goldstein's is still downtown, and the Haunted Book Shop is still downtown, and Gayfers, I think they're the only things that are still here that were here before.&#13;
R.C. : Did you or your friends ever discuss the war?&#13;
M.F.P. : Oh we would get together and talk about it, in fact, we still do get together and talk about going riding on Sunday afternoons and taking the soldiers and working at Interceptor Command and some of the things that used to happen down there. &#13;
R.C. : Did you know any of Mobile's writers or artists?&#13;
M.F.P. : I expect I know most of Mobile's writers. Caldwell Delaney has written a good many books, in fact most people give his book Remember Mobile, as a gift book to people who come to Mobile, move away, and they want a gift to take with them. But, he has written about ten different books. Evelyn Dahl wrote a book called Belle of Destiny, and Judy Rayford used to write books ( Judy died about a year ago), but he was known all over the United States. Eugene Walter has written books and he lives here now and writes for the Azalea City News. Mobile has always had a lot of writers; Erwin Craighead and Ernest Spinoloza, and Kathleen Johnston; of course, now they have Terri Cline and Roy Hoffman, Jay Higgenbotham; we have quite a lot of authors.&#13;
F.M. : Did you know ......?&#13;
M.F.P. : Yes, indeed I did. In fact, my husband offered to build a building for him to store his papers in if he would just let Mobile have them, he never would agree to let Mobile have them. I'll tell you another story about him: he sold the Gutenberg bible in New York, which was not a Gutenburg bible, and it sort of ruined the name of mobile booksellers for a while.&#13;
R.C. : Are there other things from the war you might want to add?&#13;
M.F.P. : Right this minute I can't think of anything except the only thing we're sure of is change.&#13;
F.M. : The boys here were fascinated with the blackouts and that sort of thing. Why don't you add one or two things about air raid drills and so on. &#13;
M.F.P. : All the cars had black paint over the top half of the lights. Of course, you would have to turn your lights out at certain times. You could hear a whistle going off and you'd run for shelter. It was quite exciting.&#13;
R.C. : Was there were an air raid?&#13;
M.F.P. : Not an actual air raid, just practices/&#13;
R.C. : How many air raid drills were there in a day?&#13;
M.F.P. : There would only be one in a day, in fact they would only have on in maybe a month. But sometimes, they would have an air raid and the sirens would go off and you'd have to lock up your business and go out of town. They had evacuation routes, and they'd tell you which streets you could go out and where you were to meet. Then you would leave.&#13;
R.C. : What would happen if you were in an airplane at the time when the siren went off?&#13;
M.F.P. : I never had that experience, I don't know. Of course, we were all supposed to keep a certain amount of food on hand in case anything happened, to be ready.&#13;
R.C. : Were you ever caught in a car when an air raid siren went off?&#13;
M.F.P. : No, I was usually in the book shop. I did have to close the book shop and get in the car and go to the edge of town.&#13;
F.M. : Where was the edge of town?&#13;
M.F.P. : I think I went to Spring Hill, I'm not sure.&#13;
R.C. : You've been very kind to give us your time and to share with us your memories of World War II. Listening to you will add to our record of this time. Thank you very much.&#13;
M.F.P. : Thank you for coming, it was a joy.</text>
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